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Thread: What Is Consciousness?

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    Ganesha's Avatar
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    What Is Consciousness?

    Since we are all somewhat in agreement about the supposed fact that human beings have consciousness, we can now begin to ask the question what it is.

    Is it physical or not?
    Does it influence matter or not?
    What is the relation with the mind/thoughts/emotions?
    Is consciousness one or many?
    How long can we ignore consciousness?
    How does one go about gaining consciousness?

    So many questions, but no clear-cut answers. Your thoughts are appreciated.
    ??

  2. #2
    GOD
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    No .
    No.
    They are part of it .
    One and many .
    Most people ignore it all their lives .
    Be born .
    If in doubt double the dose

    "Its hard to be humble , when you`re as great as i am"

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    Ganesha's Avatar
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    With: does it influence matter?, I meant is there some form of mental causation of physical events? i.e. if I want to move my fingers so to type this sentence, does my mind/consciousness somehow influence that?

    With the gaining consciousness question I was asking how you can become more aware of consciousness after ignoring it for your whole life, so maybe I should've phrased it differently. How does it happen? How can you become more aware of consciousness?

    "one and many"

    I guess I understand what you mean by it, but this requires a lot of filling in by me. Can you explain? How is it one? And how is it many?
    ??

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    Skilled Psychonaut maxfreakout's Avatar
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    Re: What Is Consciousness?

    Is it physical or not?
    consciousness is not physical, consciousness is not anything other than conscious

    Does it influence matter or not?
    As I type, my mind is influencing my hands

    What is the relation with the mind/thoughts/emotions?
    consciousness IS the mind
    thoughts and emotions are objects of consciousness

    Is consciousness one or many?
    Neither, consciousness is just conscious


    How long can we ignore consciousness?
    How long is a piece of string?

    How does one go about gaining consciousness?
    Taking drugs is a good way

  5. #5
    Skilled Psychonaut maxfreakout's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ganesha
    With the gaining consciousness question I was asking how you can become more aware of consciousness after ignoring it for your whole life, so maybe I should've phrased it differently. How does it happen? How can you become more aware of consciousness?

    you become aware of consciousness when you *see* it

    to see the mind, it must become manifest, to make the mind become manifest, you ingest entheogens

    normally consciousness is like a perfectly still pool of water, you look at the relflections of the world in the surface, but you dont see the water itself. Ingesting entheogens has the effect of throwing a stone into the water, so that the surface ripplies, the reflection becomes distorted so that you now see the surface *as* a surface, ie you become aware of the representational mechanism behind ordinary consciousness

    when you become aware of the mind in this way, it expands your consciousness, into the transpersonal realm

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    Heya!!

    well... i think obviously consciousness does have an influence over matter, but for this it wouldn't necessary need to be physical... it could influence it while being penetrant to the physical realm, yet residing on a different plane parallel or maybe superior to just this "physical realm" or something like that....and therefore being interwoven and connected with the physical...

    hmm and i don't know if it can be said whether consciousness is one or many... maybe it is both at the same time... it seems to be an instance or entity (or mechanism?) which controls and observes and is supposed to be the one experiencing.

    i don't think consciousness is the brain ... it's more the operator of the brain and hence the operator of the being...

    yeah and then there's the subconscious and also the unconscious in humans' minds... maybe that would be part of consciousness too, but in a different area... like for different operations and therefore in a different space and hence not "knowing of each other" (the different consciousnesses ).... so then we could indeed say consciousness can be many, but it would probably be not easy to distinguish what is one and what is the many...
    oh alright, now i'm getting confused with this

    so i don't know for how long we can ignore consciousness, but maybe it is more something like for how long can consciousness ignore us.

    and definately gaining consciousness we could probably do by becoming conscious and aware of more and more stuff inside and outside of ourselves... maybe we could do that, just by not doing anything... just observing and be the consciousness

    oh man i am so stoned right now :weedman: too stoned actually to write any more!!!

    peace :weedman:
    i'm so disgusted by the world of today.. :(

  7. #7
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    What Is Consciousness?
    What is.

  8. #8
    robhR's Avatar
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    Not.
    Not not.
    All of it.
    Both of it.
    Three years nine months? Never? What? Depends how long we can stupid.
    Acceptin' peace and universal love and everything!
    http://intelligentreconstruction.net
    People say the world isn't perfect. I have one question: "Why?"

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    Re: What Is Consciousness?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ganesha
    Is it physical or not?
    It's modulated by and registers physical processes. So as far as I can see, consciousness is physical.

    Does it influence matter or not?
    It's part of matter, it's an expression of matter, so it's difficult to say whether it influences matter or is influenced by it.

    What is the relation with the mind/thoughts/emotions?
    The mind, thoughts and emotions are all concerned with the health, safety, pleasure and happiness of the body, and the bodies it's related to.

    Is consciousness one or many?
    Many awareness generators are born, and many die.

    How long can we ignore consciousness?
    This is a rather vague question. What does ignoring consciousness mean?

    How does one go about gaining consciousness?
    You can't gain consciousness, you can only gain knowledge and wisdom. And we all know how to go about gaining those. Read books, engage in conversations with intelligent people, live a life filled with challenges and responsibilities, and take entheogens on a regular basis.
    "The present moment is the only door into existence. The past and future are not doors, they are walls."

    "We place no reliance on virgin or pigeon. Our method is science, our aim is religion."

    "Enlightenment doesn't care how you get there."

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    I have experienced consciousness that spanned the universe, being able to understand everything that was going on within it, accepting everything. I have also experienced very limited consciousness, for example when I was in deep pain or feeling a lot of anger and hate. Consciousness is very 'yin', it is the basis, the receptacle of everything else. To me it is one, but many who consider themselves separate from each other experience it. I don't think it is physical and I don't think it influences material existance, I think the mind functions like a filter for consciousness and that the mind determines our inner workings and external actions. Consciousness is just awareness of the mind, of the actions of your body, of the emotions and of the thoughts. Many people see no distinction between the two and confuse one for the other, which results in people strengthening their ego under the false flag of consciousness, identifying not with that which unites us, but with the things that keep us apart. As I said I don't think it is material, but I do think that it is the other side of the coin. Matter is thick consciousness and consciousness is thin matter (French philosopher Bergson has some interesting ideas about this). Consciousness - Mind - Thoughts - Emotions - Matter.
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  11. #11
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    Consciousness is awareness of perception.
    "But in its true meaning, the sense of responsibility is something completely voluntary; it is my answer to the pronounced or unpronounced wanting of another human being. Feeling 'responsible' for someone else, means being able and ready to 'answer'" - Erich Fromm

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    Skilled Psychonaut maxfreakout's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by restin
    Consciousness is awareness of perception.

    'Consciousness' is synonymous with 'awareness' so this^ has no meaning

  13. #13
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    it's not the same, no.
    "But in its true meaning, the sense of responsibility is something completely voluntary; it is my answer to the pronounced or unpronounced wanting of another human being. Feeling 'responsible' for someone else, means being able and ready to 'answer'" - Erich Fromm

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    Forkbender's Avatar
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    restin, can you specify the difference between consciousness and awareness? What do you understand by consciousness and what by awareness?
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    Hmm. As I see it:

    You can be aware of a table,the computer etc. - that means you appreciate its existence. It is not a passive but an active, it is an activity of the mind.

    Consciousness is one step higher, it is the awareness of awareness, if you like. While awareness is seeing and realizing the table, consciousness is the awareness of being aware of the table.

    But maybe I am just confised :wink: What do you think?
    "But in its true meaning, the sense of responsibility is something completely voluntary; it is my answer to the pronounced or unpronounced wanting of another human being. Feeling 'responsible' for someone else, means being able and ready to 'answer'" - Erich Fromm

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    Forkbender's Avatar
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    So in your view, consciousness is a form of awareness, let's call it self-awareness. I just read parts of the wiki article on consciousness and it is pretty interesting. It summarizes the philosophy of consciousness concisely.
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    GOD
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    So you mean consciousness is the awareness of being conscious ? Your just talking about diferent levels of consciousness . Conssciousness is being awake , higher consciousness is the awareness that one is awake ? So being , the thought "Iam" and the awareness of what "I am implys / can mean" ?
    If in doubt double the dose

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    Sartre distinguished between pre-reflexive consciousness and reflexive consciousness
    pre-reflexive consciousness looks into the world as is aware of objects
    reflexive consciousness looks at itself and is aware of being aware of objects in the world
    they are both forms of consciousness

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    Forkbender's Avatar
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    Okay, so we now have 10 different definitions of consciousness. Maybe one sticks out because it is most helpful to understand it and we can continue to use that?
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    Skilled Psychonaut maxfreakout's Avatar
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    "The being of consciousness is consciousness of being" - Sartre

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    Skilled Psychonaut maxfreakout's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Forkbender
    Okay, so we now have 10 different definitions of consciousness.

    we have zero definitions of consciousness

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    restin's Avatar
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    So in your view, consciousness is a form of awareness, let's call it self-awareness. I just read parts of the wiki article on consciousness and it is pretty interesting. It summarizes the philosophy of consciousness concisely.
    didn't read the wiki yet Yeah...exactly. What do you think?
    So you mean consciousness is the awareness of being conscious ? Your just talking about diferent levels of consciousness . Conssciousness is being awake , higher consciousness is the awareness that one is awake ? So being , the thought "Iam" and the awareness of what "I am implys / can mean" ?
    Yes. Hmmm, no, let's say, I am talking about Consciousness and not consciousness. I don't know, I wouldn't say that "I am is Consciousness. It is rather the total feeling, the total...well awareness of "I am". But that's how I see it or rather how I feel about my existence.
    "But in its true meaning, the sense of responsibility is something completely voluntary; it is my answer to the pronounced or unpronounced wanting of another human being. Feeling 'responsible' for someone else, means being able and ready to 'answer'" - Erich Fromm

  23. #23
    GOD
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    Consciousness doesent have to mean that something is aware of "I am" . Does a lizard have an awareness of "I am" or is it just it ?

    Consciousness is life .
    If in doubt double the dose

    "Its hard to be humble , when you`re as great as i am"

    WWW.Youtopia.ws

  24. #24
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    conscius (l.) = con (together) + scire (know)

    Together implies a certain connection - maybe the connection of body and mind and therefore the knowledge (awareness) of body and mind?

    http://www.philaletheians.co.uk/Stud...sciousness.pdf

    http://encyclopedia.stateuniversity....ciousness.html
    "But in its true meaning, the sense of responsibility is something completely voluntary; it is my answer to the pronounced or unpronounced wanting of another human being. Feeling 'responsible' for someone else, means being able and ready to 'answer'" - Erich Fromm

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    Is it physical or not?
    I don't think it is physical. I think this is what is so special about consciousness is that it has no physical characteristics or boundaries.

    Does it influence matter or not?
    Yes. Young's double slit experiment. The wave function was collapsed through conscious observation. This is on the micro scale, and may not be noticeable on the macro scale.

    How does one go about gaining consciousness?
    Through being born and put into a world where consciousness exists. Through the formation of language and the collective understanding of the world around us. Not one person can become conscious, rather it necessary to have a group in order to become conscious, in my belief.

    peace & love
    It's very much like riding an enormous roller coaster, once that baby rolls out of the station, do not stand up, do not try to climb out of your car, shut up and hang on, with the faith that most people have lived through this--Terence McKenna

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    Thanks for all your input.

    I think consciousness cannot exist apart from matter, because then it looses its object (that which it is conscious of), but that it is somehow separate from it. I'd like to here more about Young's double slit experiment, user_1919, how did it work?

    People talk a lot about 'expanded consciousness', what does this signify? That we are aware of more things than usual? Or that we are more sensitive to what we are normally conscious of? What do entheogens do to consciousness if anything?
    ??

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    Quote Originally Posted by restin
    So in your view, consciousness is a form of awareness, let's call it self-awareness. I just read parts of the wiki article on consciousness and it is pretty interesting. It summarizes the philosophy of consciousness concisely.
    didn't read the wiki yet Yeah...exactly. What do you think?
    I guess that sounds correct, although it is hard to not get into an eternal regression (i.e. being aware that one is aware that one is aware, being aware of that, being aware of that, etc.), maybe consciousness is this eternal regression of awareness. I really recommend the books by Hofstadter on this subject, although I don't always agree with him, he has a great way of looking at these problems.
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  28. #28
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    It has to do with the weird world of quantum physics. Here is a young tube video about it.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VDmbdTtcoPM

    peace & love
    It's very much like riding an enormous roller coaster, once that baby rolls out of the station, do not stand up, do not try to climb out of your car, shut up and hang on, with the faith that most people have lived through this--Terence McKenna

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ganesha
    People talk a lot about 'expanded consciousness', what does this signify? That we are aware of more things than usual? Or that we are more sensitive to what we are normally conscious of? What do entheogens do to consciousness if anything?
    I don't think expanded consciousness exists. I think the most essential thing of personal progress is unconscious elements coming into consciousness, but consciousness doesn't grow by that, because it doesn't have a size. Entheogens can help getting things out of the unconscious or subconscious into the light of consciousness.

    The natural question that comes out of this is: What is unconscious(ness)? And how can unconscious processes be brought out into the open? Do we wait for them by being still? Do we need to do something? Does it require the use of a technique and/or substance? Do these help?
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  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by user_1919
    It has to do with the weird world of quantum physics.
    Thanks, will check the vid.

    Says one quantum physicist to another:

    "You know, this quantum theory could of course all be a projection of our own false sense of identity."

    @Forkbender: Those are legitimate anbd interesting questions and I will think about it.
    ??

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