Results 1 to 28 of 28

Thread: does this hold any water

  1. #1
    pooz321's Avatar
    Join Date
    2008 Jun
    Posts
    107

    does this hold any water

    I was thinking about some legitimate claims as to why a person has a right to smoke marijuana (i personally think my existance alon is reason enough but a legal reason)and the story of the garden of edan came to mind. as the bible goes i foggily remeber, god gave adam and eve the right to every plant in the garden of edan but one, meaning you have a god given right to smoke as long as politician cant disprove cannabis's existance in the garden of edan
    Question everything, my friend, always. Established views , traditions , prejudices. all of them preconceived human notions that arent neccisarily true... what is true? you world aroung you is a perception and up to human interpretation, use your power of judgemnt to decide your path--Pooz

  2. #2

    Join Date
    2006 Apr
    Posts
    457
    That is if you want to make laws in accordance to the bible, but I'd rather not to be honest
    "You can always trust someone in search of the truth, but never trust one who claims to have found it"

  3. #3
    Experienced Psychonaut Psychoid's Avatar
    Join Date
    2007 Jan
    Location
    <~{¤}~>
    Posts
    2,279
    As I consider all religions to be fantasies, that is all but a solid argument to me.

    To me a good argument would be that weed:

    1) Has been proven to be one of the safest drugs (more than all the legal ones, or lets say on the same level than caffeine)
    2) Has a lot of medical properties which helps a lot of people to function better in all aspects of life, and can heal some diseases / medical problems.
    3) Has recently been proven to have a protective effect on the brain of adults, and to prevent various cancers
    4) Our constitution says that we are free to make important personal decisions for our lives. Considering that by using weed I'm not interfering with anyone else's liberty, laws that prohibit cannabis are anticonstitutionnal and therefore not legitimate.
    5) Could boost our economy drastically

  4. #4
    Not For Human crew Supervixen's Avatar
    Join Date
    2009 Feb
    Location
    dans la base de données
    Posts
    4,709
    That is if you want to make laws in accordance to the bible, but I'd rather not to be honest .
    I sure won't give up my secular "freedom" only in order to smoke pot...
    "I've always considered writing the most hateful kind of work. I suspect it's a bit like fucking, which is only fun for amateurs. Old whores don't do much giggling." (H.S. Thompson)

  5. #5
    Banned
    Join Date
    2009 Apr
    Posts
    6,246

    Re: does this hold any water

    Quote Originally Posted by pooz321
    I was thinking about some legitimate claims as to why a person has a right to smoke marijuana (i personally think my existance alon is reason enough but a legal reason)and the story of the garden of edan came to mind. as the bible goes i foggily remeber, god gave adam and eve the right to every plant in the garden of edan but one, meaning you have a god given right to smoke as long as politician cant disprove cannabis's existance in the garden of edan
    with pure scientific (botanic evolution) raisonement, i can't believe there was chenevis indica "in eden garden" (if it had existing a laps of time^^)
    chenevis indica is a dioïc sexual reproduction plant , "herbacée" .
    it was born more latter than other "no chlorophyllians/and/chlorophylians plants" ...
    humff , that's my books whose says that ...

    (sorry for this beautifull skill in english)

  6. #6
    spice's Avatar
    Join Date
    2006 Dec
    Location
    the square root of now
    Posts
    1,887
    pooz, so in your mind, if the Bible OKs it, then that equates to a 'legitimate claim'?

    Do you really understand what you are saying?

    LAW does not stem from religion. Law derives from REASON, which is the kryptonite of religion.

    This is what we are fighting all these neo-conservative idiots about, they think God told them all those wrong-headed things that they try to force on everyone.

    PLease don't try to use religion as a basis for intelligent discourse.

    Your line of reasoning has killed more people than every war ever recorded in the history of man.


    wrongwrongwrong


    [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_swan_theory[/url]

    "condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance"

    Albert Einstein

  7. #7
    Bastiaan's Avatar
    Join Date
    2007 Sep
    Location
    Eastern Netherlands
    Posts
    442

    Re: does this hold any water

    Pooz gratz you win the most horrible idea award and I couldn't agree more with Spice
    Get your head straight man.. that would not mean progress in any way. If there is one thing imporant at this time in history it's getting rid of all this religious crap

    Perhaps the best way to go about would be to tackle all the outdated ideas as to why it's status is currently illegal, show all kinds of examples of negative things that are occurring due to the current status and next mention all the positive things legalisation would bring about with some nice examples.
    Also, well argumented and with lots of proof, brought down to plain simple logic and perhaps even some arguments on why (the) elite and/or several corporations with power wouldn't want it to be legalised.
    When in doubt, pull the trigger

  8. #8
    MelloTrip's Avatar
    Join Date
    2008 Jul
    Location
    SixtyNine
    Posts
    396

    Re: does this hold any water

    http://www.prntrkmt.org/cannabis/guidec ... igion.html

    1. Identify a religious use
    2. Sincerely believe.
    3. Document your belief.
    4. Practice your belief.

    Does it work ? I have no idea.
    I miss GOD as well.

  9. #9

    Join Date
    2008 Jul
    Posts
    45

    Re: does this hold any water

    But I like apples, does this mean I can't eat no apples anymore?

  10. #10
    Bastiaan's Avatar
    Join Date
    2007 Sep
    Location
    Eastern Netherlands
    Posts
    442

    Re: does this hold any water

    As Mellotrip said.. make eating apples your religious use! I'm with you
    When in doubt, pull the trigger

  11. #11
    st.bot.32's Avatar
    Join Date
    2007 Oct
    Posts
    1,957

    Re: does this hold any water

    maybe pooz is just trying to come up with a religious argument to counter the religious? hmm.

    agreed, i'd personally likewise just bypass the whole thing and keep religion out of lawmaking but considering the religious do have positions of power where they will throw their moral agendas around, these arguments don't bother me so much. show the glaring holes in their arguments on both sides in and out
    I have made a ceaseless effort not to ridicule, not to bewail, not to scorn human actions, but to understand. -Spinoza

  12. #12
    Banned
    Join Date
    2007 Jul
    Location
    not in your head
    Posts
    2,995

    Re: does this hold any water

    yeah why get into politics?? we need to show them that it is indeed our religion to smoke this herb... maybe they will understand our ritualistic approach towards ourselves we practice with the help of the "sacred" THC of this "sacred plant" """designed""" (it is there so why not use it if it can be of good use kind of argument) to alter our "sacred brains"! and also maybe tell them that our attitude towards the plant and its spirit is one of utmost respect and that it's sacred mind-altering substance should not be abused but if needed could indeed be used to alter/expand consciousness (imagination etc.) or other beneficial physical effects like relaxation, pain relief (well-being, health) .

    apart of that we could make governments aware of why this amazing plant got "demonized" and marginalized by certain companies and interest groups and how that could/should also bring more economic fairness and less destruction of nature (cutting down trees etc etc, more rebuilding mentality with trees,landscapes), exploitation of natural ressources (trees, etc.)

    or maybe it would be enough if the politicians couldn't disprove cannabis as a plant of the garden of eden so you'd only have to find that passage show it to them and then wait for them to disprove it or give up their argument.

    peace :weedman:
    i'm so disgusted by the world of today..

  13. #13
    Nomada's Avatar
    Join Date
    2008 Jul
    Posts
    690

    Re: does this hold any water

    my own discussion starts before a drug having to earn popular respect in terms of utility for it to be eligible for the legal (and moral for those that might equate them together) status. I mean...you are entitled to your own suicide. That a drug might have positive health benefits is a nice thing to have but IMO not a requirement--aside from the issue of proper education on the subject of consequences.

    the acid acknowledged remorse of a thing better not done again because it will kill you can be healthy a advisor.

    but I am talking from a country that will try to put you in jail if you try to commit suicide and on its law it is written that the state's religion is catholic...

  14. #14
    Experienced Psychonaut IJesusChrist's Avatar
    Join Date
    2008 Jul
    Posts
    3,744

    Re: does this hold any water

    You're mixing the bible with legality.
    I'm not here to make someone else rich.
    Art shop; Etsy.com/shop/jonhelander

  15. #15
    Guest

    Re: does this hold any water

    ^ you can first pretend to be mixing them up in order to flip by surprisingly the fact that a book is a book and flip the head of someone who's actually be mixing them up. You'll know if they suddenly say that they can't continue the conversation because its too painful, or if aggressiveness enters.

    they sometimes just quickly ignore the new news, and they get more stubborn to the surprise of everyone on board, but if you're clever enough so as to approach in a cloak of deception, you just may produce a sufficiently strong headache.

    ...he was asking if it could hold any water.

  16. #16
    Experienced Psychonaut Psychoid's Avatar
    Join Date
    2007 Jan
    Location
    <~{¤}~>
    Posts
    2,279

    Re: does this hold any water

    People can post without having to register now?

  17. #17
    Nomada's Avatar
    Join Date
    2008 Jul
    Posts
    690

    Re: does this hold any water

    ^ lol that was me

    cool new feature

    I wasn't logged and could post. I think there's restriction on which section of the forum this is allowed tho.

    can someone confirm?

  18. #18
    Experienced Psychonaut ophiuchus's Avatar
    Join Date
    2006 Nov
    Location
    in your mind
    Posts
    2,304

    Re: does this hold any water

    whaaa?! can we vote to get rid of this feature please?? i dont want a bunch of idiots to start muddying up our forum...

    *this was in no way directed at nomada...
    cannabis is an entheogen too!

    other places i visit:
    natmedtalk
    youtopia
    shroomery
    mycotopia
    entheogen-network

  19. #19
    pooz321's Avatar
    Join Date
    2008 Jun
    Posts
    107

    Re: does this hold any water

    as nomada said i was asking your guys's opinion if this would hold any water to some conservative god fearing politicions. im not saying it is my believe and the unneccisarilly harsh critisism i received offended me (but oh th fuck well you knoww?)
    all i was asking , is , do you guys thing that the conservative god fearing politicions would go for this shit, or perhaps consider it as a valid point due to their own religious beleives....im fuckin 15 .....im trying to expand my mind give a brother a break... damn...
    Question everything, my friend, always. Established views , traditions , prejudices. all of them preconceived human notions that arent neccisarily true... what is true? you world aroung you is a perception and up to human interpretation, use your power of judgemnt to decide your path--Pooz

  20. #20
    Banned
    Join Date
    2007 Jul
    Location
    not in your head
    Posts
    2,995

    Re: does this hold any water

    better establish a stable mind first and then expand your mind bro. in your age the brain is in development and i heard that smoking weed when in that brain-developing-phase doesn't need always to be beneficial, altho i don't know if it's true, but it makes at least some sense.


    also let's make it a peace on war on drugs and don't fight this damn war. it IS a war ON drugs!! that's why it's too an information war!!
    i'm so disgusted by the world of today..

  21. #21
    ZoSoMaC's Avatar
    Join Date
    2009 Nov
    Location
    Missisauga, Ontario
    Posts
    35

    Re: does this hold any water

    why we all ganging up on Pooz?

    he did make a statement, and it takes only one to dismiss that. Also, shouldn't be done harshly. He was sharing an opinion, and yes i agree that it holds no valid structure in an argument. THOUGH! I would like to make a point, if someone else hasn't already made it. From a religious perspective of course:

    -God forbade Adam 'n Eve to sample the "fruit of knowledge". This can be interpreted (symbolically) as an apple. And in all visual representations it is an apple. BUT! im pretty sure we know (as advocates for our wonderful plant), that Marijuana, when used properly; can become quite the teacher. Does "God" then continue to forbid us to sample the fruits of knowledge? Even without religious religious intent behind the law, it still remains illegal.

    What do you think about that?

  22. #22
    Banned
    Join Date
    2007 Jul
    Location
    not in your head
    Posts
    2,995

    Re: does this hold any water

    +1
    i'm so disgusted by the world of today..

  23. #23
    pooz321's Avatar
    Join Date
    2008 Jun
    Posts
    107

    Re: does this hold any water

    my theorie in its self holds no water what so ever...i know this for fuck sake...dont for a second think i dont...
    step out of your mind and into a politicians ,( the mojority of witch are conservitive god fearers)..... yuo are presented with the fact that adam and eve had access to all plants in the garden of eden...except 1....since you dont beleive in evolution , all the plants in the garden of eden reflect todays plants...and unable to prove the identity of the forbidden fruit....one must come to beleive that cannabis was in the garden of eden and permitted by god to be used by any means man could fathom...in a tight spot now, the god fearing politician you are, you must legalize cannabis to prove your consistancy in your own beleifs ..otherwise tarnishing you reputation....honestly this probably wont work but...why the hell was eveyone one double teaming me man? im on this site to learn...negativily criticizeing me is like whipping a kindergardener for not knowing trigonometry...im not above criticizm...but damn why you gotta be dicks?
    Question everything, my friend, always. Established views , traditions , prejudices. all of them preconceived human notions that arent neccisarily true... what is true? you world aroung you is a perception and up to human interpretation, use your power of judgemnt to decide your path--Pooz

  24. #24
    Experienced Psychonaut ophiuchus's Avatar
    Join Date
    2006 Nov
    Location
    in your mind
    Posts
    2,304

    Re: does this hold any water

    dont waste your time looking for "what ifs" if they cant be either: answered, or realistically benefit you. i think it's very good that you are curious, and i hope that you can tell criticism from flaming. i think if you maybe worded your questions a little bit more specifically, then the discussion might go a little smoother. im not sure we all knew what you meant totally in the first question..
    cannabis is an entheogen too!

    other places i visit:
    natmedtalk
    youtopia
    shroomery
    mycotopia
    entheogen-network

  25. #25

    Join Date
    2009 Jun
    Posts
    85

    Re:

    Quote Originally Posted by VerusDeus
    That is if you want to make laws in accordance to the bible, but I'd rather not to be honest
    Yeah ditto. Even if the argument led to legalization there are some pretty serious drawbacks to theocracy, as history as clearly demonstrated.

  26. #26
    Banned
    Join Date
    2007 Jul
    Location
    not in your head
    Posts
    2,995

    Re: does this hold any water

    well... the kingdom of god was infiltrated by snakes. so god had to smoke so much cannabis to become high enough to remember his divinity. the symbol of the apple is really interesting in many ways, still. alright anyways... with this i appoint pooz to be a discordian pope. may he judge wisely. and may he be servant to the great mary jane.

    peace :weedman:
    i'm so disgusted by the world of today..

  27. #27
    pooz321's Avatar
    Join Date
    2008 Jun
    Posts
    107

    Re: does this hold any water

    as i declare you aswell, and everyone else for that matter. hahahaha, discordianism
    Question everything, my friend, always. Established views , traditions , prejudices. all of them preconceived human notions that arent neccisarily true... what is true? you world aroung you is a perception and up to human interpretation, use your power of judgemnt to decide your path--Pooz

  28. #28
    Skilled Psychonaut Mrjelly's Avatar
    Join Date
    2012 Aug
    Posts
    115

    Re: does this hold any water

    First you cant bring religion into the mix on this, second there is nothing wrong with the bible. The only reason that you do not want to mix the two is to avoid a power struggle in the name of god, from what I hear they can get ugly. The Bible has some great ideas and if you get into the teachings of Jesus you might actually find that he just wanted ELE! (Everybody Love Everybody!) Now how some of us humans have applied his words, well that is another story!

    Regarding Legalization... you have to fight the greedy people who use prohibition to further their causes. See when we are spending our time arguing about legalizing pot they are slipping a whole bunch of stuff out the backdoor and we don't even know it!

    As for what gives you the right... You do, the fact that you exist gives you the right to do anything. Perhaps the proper question should be what gives them the right to take away your privileges when you get caught doing what they say you cant! That is the real question, that along with who are they to decide for you what you can and cannot do (as long as you don't hurt anyone else)!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •