Results 1 to 21 of 21

Thread: Legalization Consequences

  1. #1
    Guest

    Legalization Consequences

    In my encounters with cannabis rights movements I have yet to encounter clear thinkers who think about the consequences of legalization. These issues must be addressed before any progress can be made.

    1. Pot heads (burnouts)

    There are people who abuse drugs as recreational that give others a bad name. I can not count the number of people that not only use cannabis to a extreme for years until they can barely function or worse yet those who do no discriminate between spiritual and recreational and abusive use of narcotics and other mind altering substances. These people give our cause a bad name .

    2. Mixers

    These are the types of people who are typically alcoholics often involved in gangs and mix other drugs indiscriminately. If there was no such thing as cannabis these people would be doing hard drugs anyway. If there was no such thing as alcohol they would be doing chemicals they found under the kitchen sink. They are typically street people involved in crime and gangs and when all the other drugs wear off or they can not get anything else they settle for marijuana. Cannabis is definitely not their drug of choice. But they do it often enough that people outside of the psychedelic culture see them as typical potheads.

    Ok onto the legal issues.

    One consequence I forsee if I was in congress trying to decriminalize cannabis is this. If it were legalized tomorrow who would produce the cannabis cigarettes ? Not once have I seen advocates for making pot legal address this issue. If we are to be taken seriously we must not come off as ignorant potheads who ignore consequences. If we ever succeeded in legalizing and the tobacco industry was the main legal producer and supplier of cannabis cigs it would have dire consequences for society. The fact that the cannabis culture has not considered this in their proposals to legalize shows that most in favor of legalizing are acting the antisocial and ignorant stereotype people have of us. Not once has someone I have met pro legalizing suggested legislation that forbids the tobacco industry from being involved.

    Do people realize the chemicals in cigarettes would make cannabis into a poison with no redeeming value? That the tobacco companies would definitely try to put nicotine in the cannabis thus making it a drug far more dangerous then cigarettes? Also if this is not addressed before hand then the tobacco companies would be the first to step in after legalization to increase their profits. So law makers knowing this will not take us seriously.

    Taking this further since cannabis growers will be in direct competition with tobacco companies assuming we forbid their participation then they will use all their money and influence and power to shut us down just as the alcohol industry attacked legal Kava Kava when they were threatened.

    We need a proposal that discourages recreation use, forbids tobacco company involvement, regulates so that no addictive substance is added nor chemicals for taste etc, age limits for possession and consumption, Distribution models that also limit age so that 16 olds can not grow their own and sell at school That means licensing and regulation.

    Every issue that alcohol laws and regulation addresses so must we address. Can people smoke this publicly in the street? Do smoking laws prohibiting apply?

    When considering legalizing the soft drugs meaning those that occur naturally we must consider all possible effects on society.
    We must argue for the social value of cannabis versus crack . We must decide where we will draw the line and how we define abuse. We must push for tougher sentencing for crimes performed under the influence of any drug legal or otherwise. Preferably the maximum penalties. If we do not take the consequences of decriminalization seriously why should they take us seriously when we propose a major change in societies laws?

  2. #2
    Experienced Psychonaut
    Join Date
    2007 Oct
    Posts
    1,008

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    i think a lot of your post was complete bs, im on my cell so ill go into further detail later.. but for now, if i want to sit and do nothin but smoke a quarter of pot and do drugs likmeth, heroin, or crack than that is my right as a human being, ofcourse this is only my right as long as i dont go drive a car, or make stupid decisions that endager other people, it is my right to do ANY drug and put myself in harms way aslong as it is only me who has the consequences. as far as legal distribution of pot i dont think anyone has ever thought that the industry would be monopolized by tobacco companies, i give u as example the 100s of legal marijuana dispenseraries, this is something that should be controlled and regulated as other drugs such as alcohol, i can pick apart the rest of ur post a little later, but you seem to be saying that drugs should only be allowed for spiritual use, however it is anyones right to consume whatever they feel like consuming as long as they dont endanger anyone else in the choices they make before or while being under the influence of said drugs. i can honestly say i dont see any consequences of legalizing ALL drugs as long as there is proper education,0 ie: warning label on current otc drugs.
    "Trying to Fight for Peace is like trying to Screw for Virginity."
    "Drugs have taught an entire generation of American kids the metric system." ~P.J. O'Rourke

  3. #3
    Guest

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    And you my friend have just proved my point. As I said there are very few for just legalizing cannabis and few that take herbs for spiritual reasons. You are a mixer. Mixers are why cannabis will never be legal. You see no difference between cannabis and crack. This is what the people against legalizing cannabis accuse pot smokers of promoting a gateway drug. If all drugs are equal then an argument can be made that cannabis leads to harder drugs. And you just made that argument for them. Although I do believe that all things taken in your body should be spiritual reasons I will admit for instance that candy bars are not only not spiritual but unhealthy.

    Candy bars do not impact society the way crack does. Yes sugar can be an addiction and I am all for legislation and education to slow this down. But it makes money. So I'm not holding my breath. Crack being 100 or 1000 times more addictive and serving not only no spiritual purpose but actually destroying lives and adding to crime not just drug related crime but violent crime should not be legal. Maybe one day in a different society I could imagine it working but seriously not in this day and age. Heroin? That killed my cousin. Don't know anyone that cannabis killed. Pot is non addictive physically. Pot does not cause major changes to the personality by itself and has not lead to psychological disorders. The hard drugs addict users and change personality. Some promote extreme violence. And most end in death of the user if they don't get help.

    Now I did say that I am for legalization of all drugs if we can agree that committing crimes under the influence should get the user maximum penalties with no plea bargaining for a lighter sentence. That way if I'm right about hard drugs at least I can sleep at night. But again I thought this board was about cannabis legalization. My mistake.

    Also saying the word bs doesn't take away from the facts. People on crack don't tend to stay home and play monopoly. But hey you know everything. So why isn't pot legal then? Since you know everything on the subject you should be able to legalize all drugs. You yourself are so much smarter than everyone else especially me... so you have written a bill that will be accepted by congress? You have written letters to congress that will legalize drugs tomorrow? Your arguments are air tight right?

    The truth is you can not even think clearly. I did not say that people have thought that pot legalized would be monopolized by the tobacco industry. I said the opposite! I said that NOBODY ever thought about that happening. If people had considered how greedy the tobacco industry is and the likely hood that tobacco would try to take over cannabis then they would make sure any legislation would forbid this. But most pot heads do not think this far ahead so do not show that they consider the consequences to any one but themselves. So before you get all arrogant thinking you know it all why don't you actually read the post you are challenging?

  4. #4
    BobFromReboot's Avatar
    Join Date
    2010 Apr
    Location
    Windsor, Ontario
    Posts
    24

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    Okay but alcohol is already legal so it wouldn't make a difference anyways. Let people be fucking burnouts its their lives not yours.

  5. #5
    viljo's Avatar
    Join Date
    2009 Feb
    Posts
    198

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    Once again we discuss the classic case of freedom and Citizenship.
    I support Citizenship and freedom.
    Finding the balance is getting easier thanks to age and wisdom!

  6. #6
    spice's Avatar
    Join Date
    2006 Dec
    Location
    the square root of now
    Posts
    1,887

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    "Candy bars do not impact society the way crack does"

    That is your opinion. Don't construe it as a fact.

    Would your analogy hold up if I replaced 'candy bar' with 'Big Mac'?

    Ever see 'Supersize me'?


    then-

    "So why isn't pot legal then?"

    Industry. NOTHING ELSE. The powers that be cannot create a 'proprietary process' that manufactures it outside of nature.

    The White Man wants to be able to patent it, claim exclusive rights to it, and monopolize and exploit the fucking hell out of it. THEN it can be 'legal'. (I'm white, just honest about reality, the Indians had it right...'white man speak with forked tongue)

    I no longer give a fuck whether they legislate for or against it, they are fucking idiots whose time WILL come. The writing is on the wall.....

    and-

    "so you have written a bill that will be accepted by congress?"

    is this the way you measure intelligence?

    and......

    "But most pot heads do not think this far ahead"

    Damn, way to stereotype. Are you sure you aren't a government employee?


    You sound a lot more arrogant than Justin did......you have a tone of judgmental arrogance that far supersedes what you accuse him of.

    Just sayin'
    [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_swan_theory[/url]

    "condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance"

    Albert Einstein

  7. #7
    viljo's Avatar
    Join Date
    2009 Feb
    Posts
    198

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    spice cannabis is the new tobacco.
    your just a little early.

  8. #8
    spice's Avatar
    Join Date
    2006 Dec
    Location
    the square root of now
    Posts
    1,887

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    I know that, I was making a point, and that point is this;

    it doesnt matter if they legalize it outright, as long as there are states that are willing to have medical legislation, there will be ways to use it legally, and that render the issue a moot point.

    I personally do not use the supposed legality of ANY SUBSTANCE as a barometer of whether or not its 'right' to use it.

    What my position is, is that stated above. I don't CARE what the governments position on it is, I make my own decisions on all issues without their expert guidance.

    Now, if I was looking for a role model on how to exploit, lie, cheat, and steal......

    then I would use unca sam as a role model for behaivour
    [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_swan_theory[/url]

    "condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance"

    Albert Einstein

  9. #9
    Experienced Psychonaut ophiuchus's Avatar
    Join Date
    2006 Nov
    Location
    in your mind
    Posts
    2,304

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    hahaha
    cannabis is an entheogen too!

    other places i visit:
    natmedtalk
    youtopia
    shroomery
    mycotopia
    entheogen-network

  10. #10

    Join Date
    2010 Aug
    Location
    Tampa, Florida
    Posts
    22

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    People are prescribed synthetic heroin and amphetamine pills by doctors every day - it's still legal.

    The argument that marijuana will have a negative impact on society because of its negative effects is silly at best, ignorant and illinformed at worst.

    Alcohol, tobacco, opiates... All those things are perfectly legal to produce, yet they all have incredibly negative effects on society; marijuana? It'll just make Dorito sales go up.
    The trees will illuminate
    All you see will desintegrate
    As your soul gravitates
    Never again will you hesitate

  11. #11
    viljo's Avatar
    Join Date
    2009 Feb
    Posts
    198

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    Don't turn your frustration on me.

    My original comment
    Quote Originally Posted by viljo
    Once again we discuss the classic case of freedom and Citizenship.
    I support Citizenship and freedom.
    Finding the balance is getting easier thanks to age and wisdom!
    Means that if someone I know is using cannabis to much I'll step in and help them out.

    Honestly.

  12. #12
    Experienced Psychonaut IJesusChrist's Avatar
    Join Date
    2008 Jul
    Posts
    3,744

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    marijane will be fucked by the fda just like anything else that seems to actually do something good.

    I honestly don't want the shit to be legalized anymore. Then the government will tax it and make a profit off of it. Do you think that is worth it?

    The government, cough FDA, making a profit off of marijuana. oh wait...
    I'm not here to make someone else rich.
    Art shop; Etsy.com/shop/jonhelander

  13. #13
    viljo's Avatar
    Join Date
    2009 Feb
    Posts
    198

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    spiritualanarchist I very glad I read you posted your thoughts. I have much to lean, much to think, debate and discuss over what you wrote. All will be positive.

    sorry i'm in a rush.

  14. #14
    Skilled Psychonaut Teonanacapilli's Avatar
    Join Date
    2009 Oct
    Location
    Mordor
    Posts
    338

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    Quote Originally Posted by IJesusChrist
    The government, cough FDA, making a profit off of marijuana. oh wait...
    If it feels right, it probably is.

  15. #15
    viljo's Avatar
    Join Date
    2009 Feb
    Posts
    198

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    One step forward and then two steps back with me.
    Sorry! why I take cannabis so serious is beyond me.
    Make it legal then worry about the minor details. :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman: :weedman:

  16. #16

    Join Date
    2010 Aug
    Location
    Tampa, Florida
    Posts
    22

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    The United States government would most likely spend whatever money they make from taxing cannabis to fund rehab and preventatory measures against drug abuse (the latter really just being a fancy term for propaganda) rather than anything truly insidious, just as they spend most of the money that they get from taxing tobacco and alcohol on funding AA and D.A.R.E.

    It's not really a bad thing that they would do this; it's always important to have an alternate perspective on any matter. Besides, if people are stupid enough to believe all the lies, they're probably not responsible enough to use substances that impair your ability to function properly as much as anything the members of this forum use.

    And even if they used all the money to fund D.A.R.E. type programs, are you already educated enough to know the difference between truth and fiction?
    The trees will illuminate
    All you see will desintegrate
    As your soul gravitates
    Never again will you hesitate

  17. #17

    Join Date
    2011 Jul
    Location
    Arnhem, the Netherlands
    Posts
    3

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    I would advice you to look at the situation in the Netherlands and in Spain.
    Done: tobacco, weed, hash, alcohol, calamus, hawaiian baby woodrose (LSA), salvia divinorum, herbal ecstasy (trance), magic mushrooms
    To do: kratom, mescalin, ayahuasca, kanna

  18. #18
    Logarth's Avatar
    Join Date
    2011 Jul
    Location
    North Dakota/Minnesota
    Posts
    14

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    If Tobacco companies produce Cannabis cigarettes and you don't want to smoke them then you shouldn't buy them. If Cannabis was legalized then one should obtain a grow license and smoke the weed you grow. Police Departments would probably need some kind of measurement to see how baked someone is behind the wheel like a breathalyzer.

    "The White Man wants to be able to patent it, claim exclusive rights to it, and monopolize and exploit the fucking hell out of it. THEN it can be 'legal'. (I'm white, just honest about reality, the Indians had it right...'white man speak with forked tongue)"
    -The only thing European Americans would have to do is make sure to not buy the shitty weed that comes from Indian reservations.
    "I would advice you to look at the situation in the Netherlands and in Spain".
    -I've heard there are problems with dumbass Americans coming to the Netherlands to smoke legal weed, party and act like fools. Thats about all I know. Care to elaborate? Could it have to do with legalized prostitution and the type of people that might attract?

  19. #19
    Banned
    Join Date
    2007 Jul
    Location
    not in your head
    Posts
    2,995

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    if it would be legal, there would probably be hypocrits attacking the people that are trying to embrace a more holistic perspective of viewing the world and its population etc etc just like before exactly these people were attacking the hypocrits??

    they/we have to realize we can't really change people... they can only change themselves. so it's possibly also like a general paradigm shift in the direction of not forcing people too much of what they want/should do etc etc...
    therefore knowledge seems like a relative important factor... especially "the right knowledge" if that makes sense...
    you know ... after all that endless dis- and misinformation that is going on...

    the war on drugs, after all is definately a war on the population and not on the drugs themselves... its like a social outlook
    thing... if you don't know what you are doing... how could you REALLY judge what you would REALLY do unto otherrs and what you would like them to do unto you??? so the people have to wake up from their own little, unfair ego worlds...

    AND give up their addiction to too much needless ego dramas....

    in my opinion, especially these days, peace of mind is worth than anything else really...

    one more thing... i think just like RAW, that people should BE ABLE to decide/know what they want to put in their bloodstream. a matter of responsability, that has been untrained from people's shallow minds, but to me appears
    like a very important aspect of life.


    peace
    i'm so disgusted by the world of today..

  20. #20

    Join Date
    2011 Oct
    Location
    Pottsville, Pennsylvania
    Posts
    26

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    Spiritualanarchist lmao just lmao realy your worried about burnouts aaaffffter... legalization... honestly... roflmao smh
    These are the keys that will unlock your mind when you accept the keys i have presented you with you will understand the answer to all you question is within the one asking.

  21. #21
    Skilled Psychonaut HermesTrismegistus's Avatar
    Join Date
    2010 May
    Posts
    171

    Re: Legalization Consequences

    Quote Originally Posted by RandomDude
    I would advice you to look at the situation in the Netherlands and in Spain.
    Well the other country's in Europe are getting more and more positive about legalizing, things in the Netherlands are rapidly changing. It even looks like they are started with a crusade against marijuana. Now they have made rules which prohibit coffeeshops to sell marijuana that has more then 15% of thc. And if it is up to the government they will come up with many other plans to start a war against marijuana.


    -I've heard there are problems with dumbass Americans coming to the Netherlands to smoke legal weed, party and act like fools. Thats about all I know. Care to elaborate? Could it have to do with legalized prostitution and the type of people that might attract?
    Because of this, in the future you have to be dutch and need a membership to buy marijuana

    I think the dutch government each year is getting less tolerant then the year before... And it looks like this is not going to change soon and only get more worse that it already is
    Hot Like The Sun, Wet Like The Rain, Green Like The Leaves, Life Is A Game!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •